BREAKING News! Rishi Sunak's Appointment as PM of the UK is the Death Stroke for the GBP. Apple is standing in the way of NFT Adoption and Solana is designing a phone and store compliant for Web3

[00:00:00] Christo Parabellum Podcast episode number 12, welcome in today's Tuesday, October 25th. 2022 we have a full panel today on your main host Jared Phillips with our co-host Alan Eschweiler and Joel Birch and today we are this is BBC News. We're interrupting our schedules for the following announcement.

[00:00:21] Buckingham Palace has announced the death of the British pound or the pound sterling. The statement from the palace sent the pound die peacefully at Bellmoral to South to noon. Oh my goodness, well, so there you go guys. I don't know. We are re-wintering

[00:00:36] the death of the pound sterling. Well, what's happening? You're accent. We have a voice recording. That's it. I can't even talk shit because I'm actually 100% English as you guys both know was born there. My whole family is from there. I hear on a green card to the

[00:00:57] passport and I can't even fake a British accent and now you're over here sounding all proper like so I gotta give you credit where. Hey, everyone. One of the jump in here real quick and say thank you for the support.

[00:01:09] Recently our views and listens and going off the charts and I wanted to thank all of you for doing that. If you are finding this content interesting or funny or just enjoyable

[00:01:21] do a safe or hit the like button on the videos, subscribe to the channel share with a friend as dumb as it is. It makes a huge difference for new viewers for people checking us out.

[00:01:34] And obviously we want to continue to grow this community which is already off to a great start. So without further ado enjoy the rest of the episode. Very posh. I did the best. I could. You know, the hardest part from your courting that was I was laughing

[00:01:50] while I was doing it and I was like, all right. I got to stop. I got to start over and like lining up the sound but yeah. So that obviously is the BBC radio announcement from

[00:02:00] the passing of the Queen. But I put in there the death of the the Proud Sterling and the reason why I'm saying the death of the Pound Sterling or the British pound is because

[00:02:10] we have a new Prime Minister gentleman. Have you been following this at all? We have a new Prime Minister. We do everybody's everybody's I have. We have my Prime Minister. So you do okay. Dolvin Joel, I'm talking to you directly. Have you been following your home country?

[00:02:27] Okay. Excellent. Brilliant. So yeah so Rishi Sue Nack yesterday became or was elected on or honestly know the process that well but he became the new Prime Minister after Liz Truss was in office for like 12 minutes amidst a ton of atrocious ideas that saw like everybody resigned

[00:02:49] and it was all running away from her so she just cut it off and right away they haven't election. Can you imagine if we did that here in the US where all of a sudden it was just like,

[00:02:56] oh new president we lost a we lost faith. They'd be nice. But anyway so we have a new Prime Minister in the UK I say we because you know we were colonies once before my all friends and essentially

[00:03:05] as the UK goes the USA goes let's just call us famous paid here. I'll tell him with just pure rejection on his face disagreement coming but let me get to my point first and why I even

[00:03:16] made that little stick opening. Rishi Sue Nack immediately becomes the most crypto friendly leader of AG 7 country like not even close obviously G7 being the largest then they go up G10 G12 G20. But

[00:03:31] when he was finance minister under the last administration one of his big things was I want the UK to be the crypto center of Europe and France is already trying to beat him there we talk

[00:03:42] about that if we want but he said this and this is crazy. He wants the UK this one he was finance minister let's see if he changes his tune now when he was finance minister he said I

[00:03:52] want there to be a central big digital currency in the UK by not 2040 not 2035 not 2030 2025 that's huge that's very fast is that what he was calling the brick coin I think so

[00:04:10] whatever we call you know the brick coin it should be determined but yeah like a central bank digital currency and is that necessarily news and then of itself not necessarily but the ramifications

[00:04:20] of that because we've talked and it's been a recurring theme on this show about adoption and people understanding how to how to best position themselves based on what's happening in the world whether

[00:04:32] that be war whether it be inflation or assets running away or hey you're getting your 3% increase but you're still losing 5% in your over year hello you guys have a company that's based on helping

[00:04:42] people find the correct path to stay in front okay you have all this sitting out here but the one thing we talk about is really to crypto is onboarding the UK is the financial center of the world for

[00:04:56] a lot of things insurance being one of them obviously we got the stock market but insurance being one of them if there's all of a sudden a central bank digital currency in the UK that will all of a sudden

[00:05:07] trickle its way out to the entire world quite frankly I can't think of anything that would be a bigger deal if that actually comes to fruition I said a lot of things and all over Alan's face was like

[00:05:19] ah my god so I'm gonna go to Alan first Alan react to me i i just don't care about uh UK anything I like okay and here and here's why you're not gonna do that before 2025 you're not you're

[00:05:39] not gonna do anything before 2025 like the government is the slowest thing in existence you're telling me that you're going to introduce a CBC in basically two years it's almost 2023 right so like

[00:05:54] you're not gonna get anything done this month you're not gonna get anything done next month then it's Christmas okay so you're not doing anything this year they're not gonna get it done by 2025 and unless the

[00:06:05] European system is wildly different than the US system I'm not an expert on CBCs but everything that I've heard about the idea of a US CBC is that even if the Fed decided today that this is

[00:06:19] something that they wanted to do um experts have said that the absolute earliest is eight to ten years of testing upgrading financial systems like I think at least the I didn't know this before maybe

[00:06:34] everyone else does but banks infrastructure and the Fed infrastructure is on insanely old code basis like fax machine code basis and it's just it's sort of like not worth upgrading it works all everybody's connected it would be a massive undertaking to get everybody up to the same new

[00:06:55] system and so unless Europe is wildly different and newer and more modern I'm gonna do anything in in two years so I just think that this is talk and I guess we'll see but I just I don't think any

[00:07:10] bit will happen by 2025 much less soon they have a million other things to worry about they're gonna be worrying about how they keep the heat on this winter not whether they can get some

[00:07:20] CBC launch okay so Joel I want your input on this as well but I have to ask you this question to set you up under his leadership as finance minister he tasked the country's coin producer

[00:07:32] the royal mint with creating an NFT if the royal mate creates an NFT you buy and it's like your home country no definitely not buying any scam NFTs from the government I'm with Alan on this one man

[00:07:46] uh you know ultimately though this is grounded in my consistent belief that I've now echoed on most episodes if not all episodes that it kind of doesn't matter until the macro is no longer with

[00:08:01] the macro is today no NFT launch no adoption no IPO no law is going to be short term and packed full I should say more midterm and packed full to price action which is what we care about so like

[00:08:19] is this great for crypto digital assets yes it's incredible as someone who runs a regulated entity that is currently in the process of working with international regulators any clarity saves me

[00:08:31] millions of dollars and months and months of time and that is going to enable me to and my team to build something innovative and useful and that is good for people and that will bring more competition

[00:08:46] which is also good for the market and as a capitalist like all these things are good for the market are good for or something that's good and I think that should be said but does that mean

[00:08:57] that the bear market will not be shorter because the UK is going to prioritize crypto in some way no and so that's why Alan doesn't care is and that's what he means when he says that because it's

[00:09:10] it's not gonna make number go up sooner so not not high as priority highest priority is what helps make number go up sooner for anyone who's like investing or trading but as Alan as an

[00:09:21] operator of a crypto business myself has not prepared a crypto business this is extremely exciting we're talking about it in our slack like yeah this is great news like bubble because that's all true

[00:09:30] it just depends on what your perspective is and like how you're looking at it but the average person listening to the show does not have that perspective they just again they're looking for news

[00:09:39] that's kind of moved the needle and this isn't it that's fair enough and look I don't think that in and of itself this stands as something that's actionable in the way that you're finding it

[00:09:51] but from what I've seen in this industry and from what you've all seen in this industry like think about the last bear market right 2017 to 2020 what was built during that time that

[00:10:04] people were like alright man and on chain oracle I mean whatever that is really mean shit until we're out of a bear market like why do we need you know coordinated price whatever do most of us are

[00:10:14] making our money off exchange arbitrage anyway why do we want an on chain oracle well oh then there's link that that was like yeah all right fine we'll just do our thing then and then

[00:10:24] when it came around link Marines rolling and it you know a thousand exes off the bottom because of what was being built and so I don't necessarily hold on hold on I don't necessarily think this

[00:10:37] is something that we step into and go yeah this is amazing let's roll but what we have seen and maybe you can disagree with me if you want we do not have enough qualified centralized

[00:10:56] participants to sustain the growth of crypto we just don't we don't there's not enough money there's not there's too many people I remember I talked one of my actually my trading mentor which

[00:11:10] I can't use his name but we talk every day I talked to him about the returns I get in crypto what I'm doing and he's like I'm having a pretty decent year because I'm only down 3% he manages tens of millions

[00:11:22] and I'm like oh well you know I'm up 3x from June because crypto is amazing and he's like oh my god what and I'm like yeah he's like I'm just trying to okay and I said why don't you get involved in this and

[00:11:31] you go do you understand what would happen to my fund and my license if I combing old funds that turned out being somebody that I can't do business with my entire firm my entire investment fund

[00:11:46] goes away overnight I cannot touch that I would love to it's the easiest trading in the world if you know what you're doing but I can't afford to even take that risk so no and it's like how many

[00:11:57] funds that are managing tens of millions of dollars would say yeah give me qualified investment pools that I know I'm protected from and that starts with governments waiting in right

[00:12:07] I would agree with that point so back to my point earlier of when I said I don't care it was directly in reference to CBCs like I as an individual or even as an operator have no interest in

[00:12:20] CBCs I don't think they move the needle for crypto actually think they hurt crypto because it's basically trying to replace some of the use case but to Joel's point and now to yours as well Jared like as an operator yes we want to see friendly

[00:12:38] governments because friendly governments mean friendly regulators and that means more opportunity so yeah absolutely that part the fact that he is the prime minister is good net net good for crypto but to then your other point Jared of you build the infrastructure now to then be utilized

[00:12:55] when the interest is back I 100% agree with that in fact the episode that I reference in the passes when we talked about black rock and coinbase working together um you have to do that

[00:13:07] kind of stuff now oh and then also fidelity offering Bitcoin in 401k's and sort of taking on the onus of getting that through um I would say not approval from Congress but just getting over the hurdles now is important because they are doing the hard work

[00:13:28] that everyone else will benefit from in two to three years so 100% agree it matters for those reasons the CBC thing it's not interesting to me it doesn't matter I think it actually hurts crypto

[00:13:38] hold on I just expand on that expand on it because everything you said was like these are positives and you mentioned like 19 things that are going to be things that help long term but you say

[00:13:49] short term or it's crypto I like what do you mean by that or it might be all sorts of crypto are you do you just mean because it takes away from the ethos what crypto is supposed to be no they're

[00:13:59] different things okay so CBC's in my mind hurts crypto I'll explain why in a second positive uh government governments help crypto and the people who are building infrastructure now that won't increase adoption tomorrow but the rails will be there when the interest comes back

[00:14:19] are good so there's one bad thing CBC's two good things governments and companies financial infrastructure so why why I think CBC's are bad again I'm not a CBC expert so someone can you know

[00:14:34] correct me and tell me I'm completely wrong my understanding of CBC's is there bad for a few reasons one it just basically gives all of the visibility that we it's love slash hate on the blockchain

[00:14:46] being able to to track wallets but then also have your own assets tracked imagine that but for all of your bank accounts all of your cash like there's no more cash you now use a CBC it's not

[00:14:59] like a CBC is built on some blockchain and they're gonna use magic and polygons gonna pump 10,000 acts because the government's using magic no you have like the fed is going to have fed coin

[00:15:13] and it's going to be completely visible to and completely controllable so anyone that decides hey you know what Jared we don't really like your opinion anymore uh county west got kicked out of

[00:15:24] JP Morgan slash chase I'm not a big county west fan right now however I don't love the fact that someone can be canceled from financial institutions imagine a CBC having the power to say we don't

[00:15:39] like your opinion anymore we don't like your organization anymore we don't like your business anymore you're done you can't transact you can't send you can't receive so I don't like CBC's for that reason but don't be fooled that they're gonna use your blockchain they're gonna use your coin

[00:15:53] they're gonna do their own system that they have complete control over and you will have no visibility into but they'll have complete visibility of so that's why CBC equal bad the other two points of why I think good we want good governments we want friendly

[00:16:09] governments because they're gonna be more open to businesses like ours and everyone else and we will be able to innovate within some guidelines then what was the other thing oh infrastructure

[00:16:20] you have to put it in the hard work now you have to get over the hurdles now so that when the interest comes back the on ramps are easier so the reason why last bull market was uh the way

[00:16:30] that it was which was great we we saw great gains but it could have been so much more if adoption was easier if like you had all these financial products come out late after the interest is gone

[00:16:41] well they'll now be in place so the institutions who say hey we want to take advantage of the next media we'll be able to onboard actual series capital so I'll pause there CBC's bad yellow two things good

[00:16:51] I mean yeah I agree yeah I agree I think it sounds like we all agree at a macro level ultimately why it's important but yes the last bull market was driven by speculation

[00:17:05] I would say 90% in any real meaningful infrastructure maybe 10% and a reason that it was so good is because there were so many on ramps my first ever bull market you couldn't even buy crypto

[00:17:21] period like it was so hard to get my second bull market every single person on ramp to coin base and then withdrew to bittracks and then eventually took those gains to bitmacks and lost them all

[00:17:32] this last bull market we can't even name we can't even name the thousands of apps that made it easy to buy crypto so that was a great start couldn't do really and you could trade it but there

[00:17:44] was no guidance there was no rules but it was sure it should be easy to buy the next bull market it's going to be easier to buy that's great the bearer entries already very low for crypto

[00:17:56] but now the guardrails those are being built to make it not just easier to buy but easier to invest profitable protect drawdown better understand taxes you know there's a lot of sell pressure that comes unnecessarily just due to like potential tax implication there's just so many there's a

[00:18:14] million things proper harvesting of your losses from a tax perspective all of this sort of infrastructure is what's going to be necessary to have the next bull market and so all of this stuff helps firms

[00:18:28] like path and other companies you know build something that people can use next time around that's going to be more than just buy crypto and then decide what to do with it which for most people was

[00:18:39] buy crypto which was whichever one they heard about which is sheba enu or dojo or xRP or whatever and then hold crypto right that well that was you know most people tend to get out most people

[00:18:53] just that's what they did so I can't wait for I can't wait for some of the stuff that we're building thanks to these sorts of this sort of clarity that we can get because it's going

[00:19:01] to give professionals an opportunity to make it more profitable for retail investors to invest long term yeah that makes sense i don't i think we're on the same page we're saying the same thing the

[00:19:13] one thing that i guess i'm curious about is if it's if it's a CBDC then theoretically it's built on a blockchain blockchain is by definition a public ledger i don't know how something would be

[00:19:23] veiled so like Alan you said you wouldn't be able to see it they'll be able to see it so like at that point are we talking about a uh government controlled ledger that also has secrecy enabled because

[00:19:34] like what intrigues me even more about that is I would love to know I would love to wake up every morning and have zack xbt and like hey the central big sent a ton of money to sell this stuff you

[00:19:45] know to me like that would be amazing it's not gonna work like that don't don't confuse cvdc with crypto it's just a digital it's fed coin so in your so when that happens because what i've heard

[00:19:59] speculated about the the eventual uh the ultimate purpose for that is a situation like the pandemic where it's hey we need bailout fast to consumer but that's a pie in the sky

[00:20:16] you think it's really just more we'll ship it out to our institutions who can then do that as they see safe see fit which is what ultimately the fed does right they just allow uh additional cash

[00:20:27] in a circulation through financial partners right i i i don't know okay i don't know enough about that subject to be honest with you like not all blockchain development has to be and use has to be

[00:20:43] public and not all of it has to be decentralized there's a lot of good uses for blockchain like i could use blockchain internally at my company that shouldn't be decentralized so it should be

[00:20:52] it's my business it should be we can use that tech to to move stuff around just at a small scale there's also a ridiculous need for privacy right like they're by nature blockchains are public and so

[00:21:05] there's all sorts of different protocols that are being developed for privacy on smart contracts or whatever the case maybe because that's absolutely pivotal when you and i in the future of this

[00:21:15] web three world are buying our mortgage or or getting our paychecks or whatever we don't just need all that everybody's business just because it's like you know down with the establishment no

[00:21:27] fuck that i want the establishment to protect my privacy i don't want people know how much money i make or where it is or where it goes um so there is this like element of there there's a future

[00:21:37] and i'm digressing just a little bit in the one with bomb but like there's a future where there can be a giant public decentralized Bitcoin payment network for moving money around cross globally but then there can also be thousands of smaller blockchains that serve thousands of different

[00:21:55] purposes that um summer private summer not summer fast summer slow like whatever like summer a centralized summer decentralized just depending and there's a free market by which like when i go to get my next mortgage maybe i want to go through some blockchain company and maybe their blockchain

[00:22:12] is different than the next mortgage competitors blockchain whereas like one gives me a better interest rate because it's public and one gives me a you know i'm just making shit up at the point is like it's

[00:22:22] there's gotta be this world where there's all this different use for it and i think we constantly try to like fit everything into this round circle of like well if it's not decentralized if it's not

[00:22:34] public ledger like it's not crypto and it's like it's not web-threates like that wouldn't be further from the truth and people also need to get over the fact that there's going to be use cases

[00:22:48] that you don't profit from that makes someone else money and doesn't make you money like everybody sort of like to earn everything up and arms about yeah yeah no you might just not earn

[00:23:00] right like it this just might be an internal blockchain that is for our company and if you like our product you can use it but we have 99% of the supply and it's gonna stay that way and don't

[00:23:12] complain about it not being air-drop to don't complain about like rewards or hey we're running a business and you can either decide to and i'm not talking about our business in this case but in this

[00:23:22] hypothetical that uses a blockchain it might not be public you might not own a piece of it the price might not go up you might not get a blockchain as a blockchain not sustainable but we will give give you a

[00:23:33] bad ass workout app that does all kinds of shit and does it on this like private ledger that you control the data on we're not gonna pay you to walk there's no ship coin but it is a really good tech that

[00:23:43] like works better than the other tech and protection your data and so selling it's apple right and that's the product yeah and that's just one of a million in the cases and that's okay sure sure no i look

[00:23:56] I'm with you i'm with it actually hardings back to a couple of episodes topics we've had recently I mean apto speed one of them because essentially it's the centralized blockchain it's the centralized

[00:24:07] blockchain it's the i forgot my password blockchain fine that's a part of it really it's what is called it's the i forgot my password blockchain that's for sure right yeah exactly and you don't

[00:24:17] need to own a bunch of aptos you just need a tiny little bit of gas like i think maybe i'm just realizing this now but like people needs to get over the fact that like not everything is intended

[00:24:29] to make you money use something on aptos buy a tiny bit of aptos for your gas right like buy a dollar or whatever it likes a lot like you use very little salon for gas right so like you don't need

[00:24:44] much of it you don't need to like salon you could like with build on a yeah so it's like hey this is not gonna make you money and it would be interesting if a project was just like transcribed

[00:24:53] product today um surround like surrounds itself with this make money idea because i you know how it all starts with the funding but in the future that's just gonna look very different there's a

[00:25:04] lot less need for funding to build web three products now it's a lot more open source than ever was there's a lot more resources out there but then beyond that like funding is its own separate use case

[00:25:14] and so there is a whole separate use case of blockchain where companies web three or not can fundraise using crypto coins those are the coins you buy in with expectations of profit those are called securities there will be entire exchanges around just trading security tokens and that's a

[00:25:32] great that's a great use case add it to the list like if security tokens i think we should do an episode on those soon because and it would require quite a bit of like homework but I think security

[00:25:43] tokens are going to be a thing and they're going to be a thing this cycle and could be a big narrative spinner but Joel brought up a point of and he mentioned Apple and there's a piece of news

[00:25:54] that i think's worth covering on on the topic of Apple so they made some changes to their app store and one of them was discussing the use of NFTs in app so a hard part of web three

[00:26:12] adoption on mobile phones Apple specifically is is the app store rake for Apple so in case you aren't aware when you go into the app store and you download an app and there's an in app purchase

[00:26:26] Apple gets about 30% of that now if you're a scale or you have certain number of users there's different tiers to that but at at base 30% of that in app purchase goes to Apple and that's their fee for owning a marketer for owning the marketplace and establishing the marketplace

[00:26:41] and continuing that marketplace the problem with web three is if you want to make a purchase and 30% of that has to go to Apple first no one really wants to use the Apple App Store

[00:26:54] for any sort of crypto NFT web three project so they came out and they said you can we are okay now and we will prove apps that allow you to look at your NFTs, mint NFTs

[00:27:09] but if you're trading NFTs you must use in app Apple purchases so that would be like your what's it called your Apple wallet or your Apple card and we are going to take 30% of it

[00:27:25] so no one's going to trade on an app anymore but we'll allow you to look at it the other thing is you cannot sell an NFT in the app store if it unlocks features of an app because they want to own

[00:27:36] that piece of the pie so if I in Joel's example maybe I'm like a step in this example I think it's probably what you're referring to and we're going to pay you to walk and you need to buy

[00:27:46] this NFT to get access to the app Apple says no we're not going to allow that so on this point I think it sort of gives some credibility to what Solana's wanting to do which is put out

[00:28:02] of Solana's phone because Apple is making it clear that at least right now today and they don't have any competition in this web three space so it's easy for them to say this we are going to continue

[00:28:14] to own the pie if you want to work in our ecosystem if you want to put out a product there's rules for that and if you do follow the rules we get 30% of it Solana is saying hey they're probably

[00:28:23] needs to be a competitor to this Apple marketplace that is web three focused it would allow you to make trades without some sort of crazy rake and so they're putting out a Solana phone which

[00:28:34] will then also have a Solana ecosystem app marketplace and I imagine they're going to be incredibly friendly the question is how long does it take for there to be a Solana phone hack

[00:28:46] and how do you sustain that marketplace who's going to buy a Solana phone unless there's like an insane killer app well great questions Alan thanks for opposing them to the group

[00:28:59] allow me to chime in the core understanding that I have of the Solana phone is that like most of the smartphone market it'll be built on top of in a similar way like an android to where you would

[00:29:15] still get very likely any Google play app I would imagine like that's that's when I've kind of gone down the rabbit hole little bit so from a availability perspective just you know

[00:29:29] it's hard for us to believe because the three of us we actually all we actually none of us are friends with anyone who texts in green bubbles just as like a general I don't know if I didn't

[00:29:41] listening to that about three of us but like if you don't have an iPhone cannot have my phone number the answer is no current however globally Apple only has 16% market share right iOS is a very

[00:29:55] very small percent of the global smartphone market it's you know 85% other Vivo big in China and then just literally the vast majority of market share is a conglomeration of hundreds of smartphone developers would what that means is that there is market share to be had for

[00:30:14] Solana phone or for any crypto phone you name it definitely if the vast majority of market share more than double apples entire market share is made up of no names that none of us have heard of

[00:30:24] there's definitely room for that no name segment of smartphone market share to move more quickly in the web three direction that's probably their best opportunity whoever those no names are again it's not Apple is not Vivo it's not Google phone right it's like these other they make these

[00:30:40] folks like it's not Samsung there's way more risk for those companies to move in that direction but for that 31% of the market this is probably the biggest area of opportunity and whoever

[00:30:52] nails it probably has the you know has a huge opportunity long term so I think that it's easy to be like the Solana phone is never going to be able to like compete with the iPhone or whatever but

[00:31:04] I would actually disagree just because of the global market being so you know so wide open for the taking I think there's a ton of opportunity there especially if they can make a user experience

[00:31:16] that is familiar I can I can download my Google apps you know I can download Uber but I can also easily just web three apps here I would I hear you I would buy into that a little bit more

[00:31:31] if the price point for the Solana phone was in a thousand dollars so to me if you're Solana and you're pricing your phone at a thousand dollars you're now competing with the iPhone by default so you're 100% right all of that other market share those aren't one thousand

[00:31:45] other phones right those those are those are Android phones that are I don't know in India I honestly have 150 bucks 200 I don't know but they're not a thousand dollars so

[00:31:55] I think the the question is when you buy a Solana phone do you get access to like an Android marketplace that was my understanding I'm not interested in a phone that that doesn't have Uber and

[00:32:07] Lyft and DoorDash and you know trading view and I'm trying to think of like all the apps Twitter all the apps I open right away so I feel like so many crypto projects have tried this already

[00:32:21] the phone thing so one that I can think of is Eric Feynman who coined himself the youngest crypto millionaire tried this with a phone he put out like the freedom phone first

[00:32:33] went to crypto sort of as the audience then he went to like the the Maggagang and made it like untraceable phone like you're just appealing to such a small segment I don't think the niche

[00:32:45] phones work I could be wrong but I will be surprised if this one works at that price point the the when Joel was talking about that as a concept I thought to myself yeah that could really work

[00:32:59] because I didn't realize that iOS penetration was so low I would be curious what the splits are between like fully developed nations and underdeveloped so like if you're talking about 70% of the relationships the iPhone like that's kind of what people are after anyway but

[00:33:15] that's me there's not a market share that's gonna be developing and that's kind of the point but you know what my brain immediately went to when you said that Allen when he said that Allen

[00:33:24] every style which was a wonderful idea and still is a wonderful idea and we had a conversation with Bob once on my stream about whatever style he was trying to do and it was essentially

[00:33:37] focusing on biometric IDs in underdeveloped countries because one things they don't have is a centralized ID structure to prove who they are and actually have credit but it's falling on its face because it's like you know what man like we like them having these sorts of centralized

[00:33:54] functions and a blockchain scenario but no one gives a shit and like this is far as falling on its face because Everest is not salana no disrespect to our boys over there and they don't

[00:34:06] know on the limited resources salana is uniquely positioned to actually do this I agree there have been many attempts and but those attempts weren't salana so like we can't take away a extra fact that

[00:34:22] this is a protocol that has hundreds of thousands of daily users in the defy world millions of people buying and selling in the centralized world and has literally unlimited money and has just already accessed literally millions and millions and millions of people who are interested

[00:34:39] in this type of thing that might be all you need to create that small title wave that's small wave that grows into a bigger title wave in the future they're not going to launch a phone and have

[00:34:47] massive success next year it takes decades you know long but this is what this is no doubt their vision yeah it's going to be a thousand dollars a 23 and me with a 23 and me test was like

[00:34:58] $3200 when they launched that product right now it's $399 so there is an element okay so but yeah to that point you'll I guess what I would ask is there's plenty of phones out there that

[00:35:11] are basically come as a blank slate you can get the hardware and you install the software so and those phones don't cost that here so I'm just so I'm just so it's also on sweet sagas

[00:35:21] salana phones with like dope you know marketing and shit right like there isn't element little done yeah I mean that's fair but so as as an example like to your point on on the unlimited

[00:35:31] money like I agree that they have the network effect if anyone's going to be able to do this salana has the best chance from web three but let me let me give like a real world example that we

[00:35:41] probably all remember another company see if you can guess another company put out of phone unlimited money track record of success pretty much every every resource you might need to launch a successful phone that no longer exists can you think of it? I'm wondering maybe the actual Google

[00:36:02] phone but that's still kind of a very successful it's so Windows fun yeah who has a Windows fun Windows had the network effect they had everyone has a PC especially then at the time everyone had a PC

[00:36:15] so why we Windows phone not catch on I don't know but it just didn't and I think phones are hard apples somehow figured it out they had the best thing and well I suppose I'm looking at this from

[00:36:26] like a US perspective so Julia right there's the whole rest of the world but not at this price point at a thousand dollars for a phone you are competing only against iPhone and I think you lose I think

[00:36:38] companies should spend more time figuring out how to include apple in the game if you could figure out how to eat that 30% fee or make it work within that ecosystem I think you got that way

[00:36:50] more success so let me just real quick because you guys keep talking about the price point which I agree with but if like if if the basic tenant of the phone is what you're trying to do with salana

[00:36:59] you could also if you have unlimited money and think about the financing that's available through contracts right now okay so let's say okay step in as a partner of the salana phone and

[00:37:09] you know if you do X amount of things we will hold this money for you and Nescro and if you do these functions will release this over 12 months and pay it towards your phone bill that you need like there's

[00:37:20] a thousand ways that people would come in and they'd be like hey it's a thousand bucks or you pay 12 bucks and you have to hit these achievements in our protocol we'll help pay your phone that right there

[00:37:28] guys you just solved both things in a bunch of protocols that's just got new users that's interesting idea cost a thousand bucks guys this is an android phone it probably is costing salana for six dollars

[00:37:38] and if that they're selling it for a thousand because they can only service so many they're selling for a thousand because they don't want there what is winning is winning is blind to band baby

[00:37:47] app supply and the man winning is selling a thousand of these things and then them working and then selling 10,000 and then a hundred thousand etc so you just get point it's a thousand

[00:37:56] point because they other if it wasn't a thousand dollars they would sell out one minute and they probably will sell out in one minute anyways so um they probably will I would just leave it

[00:38:05] I it's a second just tiny tiny point if we don't actually think that we're going to see an apple crypto wallet and a google native crypto wallet before any other crypto phone can gain

[00:38:18] mainstream then you're crazy apple and the google both have native crypto the world wallet and native crypto browsers as soon as they figure out some of the rules around how do we KYC blah blah well

[00:38:29] how do you KYC it's built into your fucking SIM card guy it's the easiest KYC ever known you go to a device wireless you've got a contract the effort this KYC is built in this

[00:38:37] great think about it the phone is already the operating system to your life that is not getting less that is not going to be less of an operating system to your life most of us use five apps in 20 years

[00:38:47] you will you will live inside this world more so than you do now it's a long term game and I think you just need to keep in mind that like apple and google are definitely well under development from a crypto wallet

[00:38:57] perspective I know we're out of time and so we're gonna wrap it up here but I have one last thing to say because it's it's it's off topic but I just want your quick reaction because based on what you're

[00:39:09] saying we're talking about like the development of technology and where things are going etc etc. did you guys see the press release of what the metacwest pro 2 is going to be that comes out literally today 15 hundred 15 dollars you've seen what it can do

[00:39:26] no first of all oh my god you gotta look at it dude it's literally four times the resolution of the best one available it has so much more processing speed it's going to pull in augmented

[00:39:39] reality where it's not like you know is it like for sale today can I go buy it for sale or really release on 10 25 okay today literally you could walk out of your door because it was released this morning

[00:39:52] and it's supposed to be amazing so like you talk about everybody talks about like the born a land sale and the metaverse and all that ship like what they are actually trying to do

[00:40:03] nothing existed to be able to actually try to like pull that augmented reality in which is kind of what Joel was just alluding to with us all living in this even more than we already do but this is

[00:40:12] kind of that next step in like mainstream VR augmented reality you could actually pull these things together so good point to bring up one thing that I would say is that my biggest complaint about my quest

[00:40:24] which is behind me is the resolution so I'm like glad that they were times that four times yeah that's that's impressive I do want to see it I will say a headwind to all of this because I agree

[00:40:38] that that meta is probably a lane to adoption meta is getting absolutely spanked by a large number of shareholders they are pushing back saying if you want to do this spin out the the Facebook

[00:40:58] aspect because I don't want to own this business they are spending I don't quote me on this I believe it's $30 billion in opx this year on headset stuff and that is more than I'm going to

[00:41:13] forget the stat that was more than like any recent years added together so investors are saying stop it stop spending all the money on this we don't believe that this is the future of meta you need

[00:41:24] to spin out Facebook because I have no interest in owning this stock when they're combined I want to own Facebook the cash cow I don't want to own meta quests money pit and so there's a lot

[00:41:36] of pushback going on right now so Brad Gersner release a letter I believe the yesterday and went after Facebook's voting structure so Mark Zuckerberg has I believe 90% of the voting ability for that business so he can't really be pressured so the way it works is like

[00:41:55] his founders shares have way more voting power than everybody else not that he owns 90% of the company but he has the voting power so no he's the king right no and you he can hear you out but

[00:42:05] he doesn't have to listen and so what they're starting to do is put public pressure on changing that so that investors if they don't believe in the vision can say hey Mark take a hike I think that

[00:42:16] that will catch steam because Facebook is down 60% while every other major tech stock like in that category is down 23 to 25 so people are getting sick of that I would pay attention to that

[00:42:31] losing steam because people are getting fed up with it I'll tell you what Alan Joel can't say because they got like responsibilities in shit but I can say it not financial advice if he actually

[00:42:38] gets voted out of voting that'll be a great day for Facebook stack okay just yes I don't know the things so you'll buy you know if you bought after the news you already missed it it's going to

[00:42:49] be up 10 15 20% the day that people are losing faith in his ability to make decisions and this is a massive bet for him I can't imagine the pressure he feels well that's that's really

[00:43:02] so Joel any parting shot I mean if you like what does a guy have to do you know build Facebook and then fucking a couple years go by and like NFTs come out and then everyone's like Mark

[00:43:11] like a Merchett works in idiot like dude wait I don't know there's no there's no winning in the eye of public perception it's what have you done for me lately and maybe that's fair but

[00:43:23] at the end of the day like at the end of the day I do kind of reluctantly feel like meta is still a major major player in the infrastructure of like technology in 20 years

[00:43:41] I think a lot of people thought Microsoft was dead a long time ago and they've never done better they're actually thriving Apple actually did die once and now owns the world meta meta launched web two like those other companies are like hardware companies first and foremost

[00:44:00] they own the biggest brands from WhatsApp to Instagram and countless underneath that VR will catch up they can you know I'm just not long-term worried about meta's so so what you're saying essentially to to boil this up is Joel is saying in before

[00:44:19] the long form Atlantic article talking about how Mark Zuckerberg's right and like 10 years I think that is fair alright well I'm gonna play us out boys this was a fun episode

[00:44:35] I was I enjoyed it I think we covered a lot be sure to like and subscribe and hit the notification bell on youtube boys for the Caramel and podcast episode 12